Some of my thougts on Heb 12
One of the reasons i changed from NIV to ESV is that NIV says God punishes us, where ESV says chastise, as does KJV thats quite a huge translation error in the NIV!
Chastisement is a loving father teaching, training and instructing us. Another definition is child rearing. This is for our strengthening, preparing us for hardships of life and maturing.
ESV Study Bible Commentary
Discipline (Gk. paideia) was a common term for childrearing through instruction, training, and correction;
Yes Father corrects, trains and instructs us. He does not punish us, for He punished Jesus in our place.
If Father punished us for our wrongs He would have to punish us everyday! That would not be good news! But if we are in permannat training thats good news for then we are constantly being strengthened, and our effectiveness will grow untill we die. This training is in the context of the new covenant, where our sins are not counted against us, where His throne is approachable, where He has qualified us for ministry and where we can do all things thoguh Christ. It's important to remember the backdrop of Hebrews 8, 9, 10, 11 before we go to chapter 12. The backdrop is all the great promises and the new covenenat.
Some say Hebrews 12 menas God can give you cancer and sickness to punish you and teach you? Does this hold up to new covenenat promises. Remember in Isaiah 54v15If anyone stirs up strife, it is not from me; whoever stirs up strife with you shall fall because of you.
God does not cause us strife in the new covenant!
WHEN there is strife, He will turn it to our advantage! What the enemy purposed for evil, the Lord will use for Good. But the evil is not from God!
17no weapon that is fashioned against you shall succeed, and you shall confute every tongue that rises against you in judgment. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD and their vindication(Or righteousness) from me, declares the LORD."
So Hebrews 12 for me is such a classic example of how we need to see every scripture in context. Every scripture comes in a passage, a chapter, a book and a covenant!
Some maintain that when you are being disciplined, God stops blessing you? Well does our disobediance undo the Abrahamic Covenant? Meaning do we loose the blessing when we sin? Well did Abraham? No. We are also chidlren of Abraham.
Hebrews 10:
This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds," 17then he adds, "I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more." 18Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin
And in Romans 4
7"Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; 8blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin."
Well Does God count our sin against us or not? Are they covered or not?
Or sins are covered and they are clearly and scripturally forgiven.
On that canvass of security the Father is training His sons, correcting and leading them!
Wayno
I'd like to add that the main way he teaches and corrects us is by showing us who we are in Christ, and by the conviction of the holy spirit that we are righteouss.
Chastisement is a loving father teaching, training and instructing us. Another definition is child rearing. This is for our strengthening, preparing us for hardships of life and maturing.
ESV Study Bible Commentary
Discipline (Gk. paideia) was a common term for childrearing through instruction, training, and correction;
Yes Father corrects, trains and instructs us. He does not punish us, for He punished Jesus in our place.
If Father punished us for our wrongs He would have to punish us everyday! That would not be good news! But if we are in permannat training thats good news for then we are constantly being strengthened, and our effectiveness will grow untill we die. This training is in the context of the new covenant, where our sins are not counted against us, where His throne is approachable, where He has qualified us for ministry and where we can do all things thoguh Christ. It's important to remember the backdrop of Hebrews 8, 9, 10, 11 before we go to chapter 12. The backdrop is all the great promises and the new covenenat.
Some say Hebrews 12 menas God can give you cancer and sickness to punish you and teach you? Does this hold up to new covenenat promises. Remember in Isaiah 54v15If anyone stirs up strife, it is not from me; whoever stirs up strife with you shall fall because of you.
God does not cause us strife in the new covenant!
WHEN there is strife, He will turn it to our advantage! What the enemy purposed for evil, the Lord will use for Good. But the evil is not from God!
17no weapon that is fashioned against you shall succeed, and you shall confute every tongue that rises against you in judgment. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD and their vindication(Or righteousness) from me, declares the LORD."
So Hebrews 12 for me is such a classic example of how we need to see every scripture in context. Every scripture comes in a passage, a chapter, a book and a covenant!
Some maintain that when you are being disciplined, God stops blessing you? Well does our disobediance undo the Abrahamic Covenant? Meaning do we loose the blessing when we sin? Well did Abraham? No. We are also chidlren of Abraham.
Hebrews 10:
This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds," 17then he adds, "I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more." 18Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin
And in Romans 4
7"Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; 8blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin."
Well Does God count our sin against us or not? Are they covered or not?
Or sins are covered and they are clearly and scripturally forgiven.
On that canvass of security the Father is training His sons, correcting and leading them!
Wayno
I'd like to add that the main way he teaches and corrects us is by showing us who we are in Christ, and by the conviction of the holy spirit that we are righteouss.
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